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Post by ClockworkOcean on Oct 26, 2024 18:15:15 GMT
The US presidential election is just over two weeks away. I'm not sure if we have any Americans on the forum at the moment, but the outcome will likely have implications for foreign policy, etc.
Do you have any hopes, concerns or predictions?
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Post by Bernard Marx on Oct 26, 2024 19:16:00 GMT
If I could vote, I’d probably opt for Jill Stein. Whatever my differences with her on specific issues, she’s seemingly the best on domestic and foreign policy. She’s opposed to incessant nuclear proliferation, castigated the US-uniparty’s facilitation of the Gaza Genocide, advocated for the release of political prisoners unjustly jailed by rogue governments (most recently, Bogdan Syrotiuk, having been arrested by the Ukrainian government for protesting against the Ukraine/Russia Proxy War) and advocates economic redistribution over a continuation of neoliberalism.
RFK Jr completely lost me after his bizarre attack on Roger Waters last year (then being slandered as antisemitic) and subsequent incessant Israel apologia. Likewise, like Trump, his only major difference to the Democrats on Foreign Policy is that he’d rather rescind from stupidly antagonising Russia to further stupidly antagonise Iran and China instead. Rubbish. Mind you, I think his chances of taking off as an insurgent “outsider” candidate disappeared over a year ago. He’s essentially another Tulsi Gabbard.
Harris and Trump can both get fucked. Anyone who seriously believes that either offers intelligent or cogent answers to America’s (or, indeed, the world’s) ills is fooling themselves. Harris is a clueless technocrat who, as with Clinton in 2016, has pathetically relied on a racialist/identity politics-driven policy platform coupled with an amorphous appeal to the “middle-class” (as if they’re the most disaffected in the country!), all whilst offering no positive economic or worldwide vision. More bail-outs for big business, more neoliberalism, and more imperialism destined to catalyse a Third World War. Trump, meanwhile, is merely a social inversion of this. His economic policies offer precisely bugger all to the disaffected, and foreign policy-wise, the only difference between himself and Harris is that he’d rather focus on Iran and China instead of Russia. Socially, he’s a reactionary oaf who believes that immigrants eat cats and dogs. I’m unsure if any further comment is required on that score…
However, Harris’ pathetic policy platform only amplifies Trump’s appeal to the disaffected (leaving anti-Trump sentiment aside, I can’t think of a single reason to vote for the Democrats contrary to against Trump), and unlike the 2020 election, the 2024 election is not a de facto Referendum on Trump’s handling of COVID. As such, although it’ll undeniably be a close race, I can see a Trump victory taking place. But I got 2020 dead wrong, so who knows?
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 26, 2024 19:23:09 GMT
I would vote for Jill Stein. I don't care if it would be a wasted vote. I could never vote for either Trump or Harris. Both are decadent and corrupt and both have distracted people on both sides of the spectrum into thinking that either will change or even make things worse. Trump had 4 years to drain the swamp, he f*cking swam through it.
He may be a bit better on some foreign policy blunders, but even then don't trust him. Look at how he flip flopped on Assange?
To be fair Jill Stein would probably be bought and paid for if she got in. (I'm still not over Tulsi's betrayal LOL.) Still for the moment at least she seems the only semi decent choice.
The whole system in America needs changed from top to bottom.
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Post by zarius on Oct 27, 2024 12:51:01 GMT
Never heard of Jill Stien, but third party is the way of all rational beings. 'Pubs and Libs lost the right to lead ages ago.
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 27, 2024 16:11:29 GMT
Never heard of Jill Stien, but third party is the way of all rational beings. 'Pubs and Libs lost the right to lead ages ago. I agree. To be honest I know very little about the current political landscape in the States, beyond the obvious. But as with the UK, both the main parties are lost causes. Harris comes across as a clueless mascot for a party that has been flailing for decades under the weight of its own hypocrisy. Trump though is simply rotten to the core and underneath it all I believe he's a vile opportunist who is not too many steps away from being an Epstein type of character. I would never vote for him, ever. |
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 27, 2024 16:18:39 GMT
Never heard of Jill Stien, but third party is the way of all rational beings. 'Pubs and Libs lost the right to lead ages ago. I agree. To be honest I know very little about the current political landscape in the States, beyond the obvious. But as with the UK, both the main parties are lost causes. Harris comes across as a clueless mascot for a party that has been flailing for decades under the weight of its own hypocrisy. Trump though is simply rotten to the core and underneath it all I believe he's a vile opportunist who is not too many steps away from being an Epstein type of character. I would never vote for him, ever. The thing that annoys me the most is neither candidate will do what I long for, a blanket ban on all weapons to Israel. The Israeli army are nothing but cowardly, violent thugs who aren't used to fighting proper wars. They attack civillians and the red cross, so without advanced weaponry they'd have to curb it a bit. Sadly neither will do that and both can therefore f*ck off. |
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 27, 2024 16:23:41 GMT
I actually don't think politics generally has ever been in a worse place.
I was always a big advocate of voting and took an interest in political issues.
But the last decade has destroyed all that to the point where I think it's all just a massive crock of shite.
Outside of my personal life, I think we are basically f*cked, and I wouldn't feel particularly bothered if the planet suffered the same fate as the end of Lars Von Trier's Melancholia. 🙄
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 27, 2024 16:27:15 GMT
I agree. To be honest I know very little about the current political landscape in the States, beyond the obvious. But as with the UK, both the main parties are lost causes. Harris comes across as a clueless mascot for a party that has been flailing for decades under the weight of its own hypocrisy. Trump though is simply rotten to the core and underneath it all I believe he's a vile opportunist who is not too many steps away from being an Epstein type of character. I would never vote for him, ever. The thing that annoys me the most is neither candidate will do what I long for, a blanket ban on all weapons to Israel. The Israeli army are nothing but cowardly, violent thugs who aren't used to fighting proper wars. They attack civillians and the red cross, so without advanced weaponry they'd have to curb it a bit. Sadly neither will do that and both can therefore f*ck off. They'll never do that. The only thing America really cares about is money. |
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Post by ClockworkOcean on Oct 27, 2024 16:35:32 GMT
The thing that annoys me the most is neither candidate will do what I long for, a blanket ban on all weapons to Israel. The Israeli army are nothing but cowardly, violent thugs who aren't used to fighting proper wars. They attack civillians and the red cross, so without advanced weaponry they'd have to curb it a bit. Sadly neither will do that and both can therefore f*ck off. The Jill Stein vs. Cornel West situation is frustrating. Both appear to be worthy candidates with solid, humanitarian positions on the plight of the Palestinians. They were working together last year before before some kind of dispute over the internal affairs of the Green Party led to them launching two separate campaigns. Why must the left always descend into infighting? |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Oct 27, 2024 16:38:43 GMT
I actually don't think politics generally has ever been in a worse place. I was always a big advocate of voting and took an interest in political issues. But the last decade has destroyed all that to the point where I think it's all just a massive crock of shite. Outside of my personal life, I think we are basically f*cked, and I wouldn't feel particularly bothered if the planet suffered the same fate as the end of Lars Von Trier's Melancholia. 🙄 I don’t share that nihilism (or, indeed, Von Trier’s!), but I can somewhat relate, insofar as I was markedly more idealistic before 2019. More naive too, admittedly, but the 2019 UK election (coinciding almost exactly with my Grandad’s death, himself a long-standing Trade Unionist who was energised by Labour’s leftward shift) left a damaging mark which saw me become unprecedentedly cynical (not long after the optimism of 2017). It also coincided with the single worst period of my personal life and my entering a massive rut (which never really subsided until after I left Oxford). I responded differently to you in the sense that I became more- rather than less- politically invested, purely because I wanted to understand *why* politics had declined to such an extent and what such idealists had misinterpreted or got wrong. But alas, it’s not always an easy process. I’ve been compartmentalising more often recently and taking a break altogether so as to avoid despairing, as many on the left of politics admittedly do. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Oct 27, 2024 16:40:40 GMT
Why must the left always descend into infighting? It’s either a battle over dreary specifics within one’s political programme, or a battle for unbridled moral purity. Some of these people need to re-watch Life of Brian and see the resemblances. It’s played a huge role in my oft disillusionment. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Oct 27, 2024 17:08:45 GMT
Trump though is simply rotten to the core and underneath it all I believe he's a vile opportunist who is not too many steps away from being an Epstein type of character. I would never vote for him, ever. Trump and Epstein were remarkably close, so your beliefs almost certainly correspond to reality. Mind you, by the looks of it, neither major American party will be winning this poll anytime soon… |
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 27, 2024 17:30:17 GMT
I actually don't think politics generally has ever been in a worse place. I was always a big advocate of voting and took an interest in political issues. But the last decade has destroyed all that to the point where I think it's all just a massive crock of shite. Outside of my personal life, I think we are basically f*cked, and I wouldn't feel particularly bothered if the planet suffered the same fate as the end of Lars Von Trier's Melancholia. 🙄 I don’t share that nihilism (or, indeed, Von Trier’s!), but I can somewhat relate, insofar as I was markedly more idealistic before 2019. More naive too, admittedly, but the 2019 UK election (coinciding almost exactly with my Grandad’s death, himself a long-standing Trade Unionist who was energised by Labour’s leftward shift) left a damaging mark which saw me become unprecedentedly cynical (not long after the optimism of 2017). It also coincided with the single worst period of my personal life and my entering a massive rut (which never really subsided until after I left Oxford). I responded differently to you in the sense that I became more- rather than less- politically invested, purely because I wanted to understand *why* politics had declined to such an extent and what such idealists had misinterpreted or got wrong. But alas, it’s not always an easy process. I’ve been compartmentalising more often recently and taking a break altogether so as to avoid despairing, as many on the left of politics admittedly do. Quite naturally so in your relative youth! 😊 When I was your age and youngerI was much the same in the sense that I was galvanised by what was happening politically. I've tried to touch on this before, but actually experiencing life as an adult in the pre-neobiberal age made the Regan/Thatcher economic policies starkly repellent. In a Britian before true globalisation as we know it today really existed, Thatcher was the big evil. It's absolutely no exaggeration to say that she changed the face of the Britain that we knew before. And I firmly and strongly believe that we are still living with the results of it today. I was active back then on demo's ranging from the Anti Nazi League (which I learned about through it's connections to the Punk scene) to the poll tax marches. Over the years I gradually dropped back from the front but still cared enough to study the political form and vote accordingly, and became active in online politics groups. I really think that Blairism was the beginning of the end and even by 2010 I was beginning to tire of the futility of getting angry and upset. Probably leaving the UK really put the lid on it, although I still voted for Corbyn from across the pond. I think it's the years turning into decades that gradually wore me down. You have yet to experience how the passagr of time can make you jaded. Though I hope you never do. But i think that along with finally finding a deep satisfaction in my personal life makes the difference. My fight these days is for peace of mind and approaching retirement age changes your focus inwards somewhat. Anyway, I'm starting to ramble.... But on Melancholia, it's not so much a comment on nihilism, but a comment on chronic depression, and how a person in that state can sometimes feel remarkably calm when everyone around them is losing their heads. Ironically, because they've dialled down so much on caring. Sometimes the people who care too much are the ones who become chronic depressives because they can't deal with the amount of shit in the world and end up going the other way because caring to that degree hurts.So when a massive catastrophe happens they just accept it. Anyway, it was still a complete misunderstanding about Wagner's Tristan Prelude which was used for the score. He might’ve been better of with something by Mahler. 😁 |
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Post by rushy on Oct 29, 2024 22:29:07 GMT
I'd vote Harris, but only because I take no interest in following politics.
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Post by iank on Oct 30, 2024 7:17:56 GMT
If Harris wins, we're ALL cooked.
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