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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2023 1:09:46 GMT
They've already set up Davros, I wonder if the bubble-headed Emperor will make his first onscreen appearance?
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Post by henshin on Nov 26, 2023 3:34:58 GMT
Just watched it.
For me...3 out of 5.
Tonally, it was Planet Of The Dead, when it comes to the specials. That is, a fun romp with humour, action, thrills, and a simple plot. Not much in the way of a payoff, but we all know what followed after Planet Of The Dead. Given how RTD has described the second special, I think we'll be in for a treat, just as we were for Waters of Mars.
Yes, the woke stuff was definitely there, and well below the standard that RTD had set for himself back in 2005. During the Eccleston/Tennant era, the representation felt natural by giving us characters that were likeable, and true to the plot. There were many moments in this where the LGBT stuff was in search of a plot.
It felt lazy in many areas.
But, i'm ok with what RTD is setting up, and it's good to see the old band back together.
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Post by henshin on Nov 26, 2023 3:40:12 GMT
Oh, just an afterthought - the bloody sonic screwdriver!
This was a sour point in the episode for me and, frankly, the worst habit of the RTD era. I always felt that the sonic screwdriver was overpowered. At the time, it served as a weapon, a lockpick, and a recharger. Now it also expands as an air tablet, and a bulletproof shield.
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Post by medicusitic on Nov 26, 2023 4:22:06 GMT
Reading this thread is like reading reddit. Not one thing done in the RTD era was good with maybe the exception of blink. Just watched one minute of it, in the usual place one watches Doctor Who "on the down low". Its laughably bad with this exposition "Donna saved the universe by absorbing the power of the time lords into her mind". Nostalgia is blinding the entire fandom except for Iank who has maintained his clarity.
Gotten to minute 1-2 the new sequence is a downgrade from the 2005 one.
Minute 2-3 the music sounds like something a youtuber would put on the background, sounds royalty free, and doesn't fit a dark British city center.
Minute 5 to 7 are first Alloyz, and the exchange between Tennich 2.0 and the cab driver is laughably bad. I can tell the cab driver is acting, and the cab driver is also a push over who lets his wife (Donna) walk all over him. I can tell this was written by RTD.
Minute 7 Tennich 2.0 is standing in plain view of dozens of first responders and soldiers goes unnoticed and he manages to break a chain link fence with the sonic screw driver.
Minute 8-11 we are already on the trans thing were we have to all lie to ourselves to appease someone's feelings. I am with Yak and Iank its clearly a guy I am not going to lie on an anonymous internet forums.
Minute 11-12 the over bearing music with the over dramatic dialogue that is overly poetic for someone like Donna. She goes from "Oi I am an idiot who watches the X-factor" to giving a dramatic speech about how much she lost. Davis is really hyping himself up as if his reign of Doctor Who was impressive.
Minute 12-14 the alien Meep crashes close to Donna's house and her child manages to find and talk to it. Donna's child talks to Meep as if it were an ordinary bloke down the street. The voice is really cringe as well that entire interaction looks like it came from a fan film.
13:30-14:00 we see the cheap rubber aliens with more bad voice acting "It is the.... MEEEEP.. we seek" why are we taking throw away designs from a weekly magazine? We have modern day Earth and shots of a factory next to really rudimentary alien and ship designs.
14:00-15:00 The Doctor talks to a UNIT scientific advisor. He discusses his re-regeneration with her and she somehow knows its forbidden for the Doctor to know about his future. She delivers one really bad line "That is your future you cant know that, that is forbidden" don't know why they didnt do a 2nd take on that one.
15:00-17:00 Tennich hypes up Donna as his best friend (I suppose in NuWho that is true because the Doctor would rather play football than see the dying Brigadier).
17:00-18:00 Unit Soilders open up the space ship greeted with poor CGI that changes their eye colour (its so the idiots who watch this know they are under mind control because if it was subtle they would miss it).
18:00-22:00 Donna's Child and Meep talk.. really boring full of RTDisms. Very convenient that Donna's Child makes stuff animals so Meep could blend in. I mean its Davis everything has to be contrived. As UNIT soilders move out to experience an actual story Tennich 2.0 gets into family drama at the Nobel home.
22:00-23:00 Wow what a great episode of Eastenders with Aleins were we talk about our feelings while Tennich patches up a teddy bear. How can any tolerate his? Also UNIT runs nursing homes for British veterans.
24:00-25:00 We get more brain washing by Russell were Jacob tells the Doctor not to assume the Meep is a he. We also get a reference to Robot, the Meep says "I am the definite article".
25:14 Tennich uses his sonic screw driver to pull up a visor on a helmet.. that is clearly some plastic material....
26:03 The dad tells the soilders to stop shooting because he has a kid in the house. His child replies with "nevermind me we go to save the meep". I can tell this was a weekly comic book the characters after talking to the meep for 30 seconds are now going to risk their lives to save it.
26:18 Tennich 2.0 forms a force field out of his sonic screw driver. He draws a blue translucent rectangle with it that blocks bullets and lazers. The soilders are too stupid to realize their weapons do no damage and dont move forward. Also during the entire firefight in the corridor of a house neither side manages to get a hit on the other.
The only realistic human reaction comes at this point when Donna yells about her house being destroyed.
28:00 Tennich 2.0 manages to use his sonic screw driver to break mortar between bricks. Its a magic wand again.
28:00-30:00 We get a fire fight on a road surrounded by houses somehow no one other than our main characters notices and the lights remain off. Also I am sure in series 14 and 15 they will be a person on modern day Earth who doesn't know aliens are real despite Russel showing them invade areas with high populations nearly a dozen times. Donna didn't know aliens existed until she sees the Meep so I guess the history of the Dalek invasion, the Dalek/Cyberman invasion, the Sontarian invasion, and etc were forgotten after 15 years. This is why Classic Who made it so the general public didnt know about aliens and tried to keep the number of people involved with it relatively low (though I will admit it failed a few times at this). We also get a scene where DONNA'S FAMILY AND THE DOCTOR WALK A FEW METERS BEHIND the aliens and they dont notice. This is really written by stupid people for stupid people.
31:00-32:00 The Doctor puts on a judge's wig and gives the aliens a stern talking to and they just drop their weapons (he also summons them with his sonic screwdriver). Shocking twist the green bug aliens are good and the meep is bad. The bug eyed monsters didnt kill anyone and have their weapons on stun. The soldiers who were put under mind control were done so by the meep. The buy eyed monsters just monologue about how evil the meep is to the doctor in front of the meep. Neither the meep or the bug aliens fight eachother and just accept the doctor as a judge.
33:00-34:00 The meep gets sharp teethe and evil eyes and essentially goes "HA HA HA" and shoots the aliens. But they have enough time to say some sad words to Donna as the meep's UNIT soilders pull up. The soldiers in typical NuWho fashion just stand there as set dressing and wait until the sad moment is over to capture him.
35:00-36:00 We are still stuck on Donna giving away her lottery money 15 years ago. She gives her reason "to help people" as if its a deep emotional moment. "Why did you give to charity?" "To help people". Davis presents this as a shocking revaluation.
36:00-37:00 the meep is being paraded as a king by the UNIT soldiers and steel workers who are repairing its ship. Its laughable to see this badly made CGI sequence with these soldiers heiling it.
38:00-39:00 UNIT science advisor has a wheel chair with in built non lethal weapons to save the Doctor and crew. She also has rockets to shoot holes through walls. Donna remembers the doctor and doesnt die basically killing the little stakes they were in Sereis 4 ending.
39:00-40:00 Tennich 2.0 runs around like an idiot in the Meep's ship trying to stop it.
41:10 we have characters telling us the obvious. The Nobels cant leave the steel mill because of a flame and the dad says "We cant get out we are trapped." A stupid show for stupid people.
41:00-42:00 We get the End of Time dilemma again. The Doctor and Donna separated by glass and to save nine million Londoners, Donna has to die. Even though she called the Doctor, the doctor a minute ago. So I guess she can remember him, but she cant help him? RTD is making this up on the spot.
42:33 TENNICH HAS HIS END OF TIME MELT DOWN AGAIN. HAHAHA. THIS CANT BE REAL? At least End of Time built up to the moment between Wilf and the Doctor. Mere minutes ago we had comic gags with Meep and now we have Tennich crying. This is just bizarre. "WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE THIS" and people call NuWho emotionally mature? Its a show written for Tumblr girls. Lets not even mention its really stupid to have a small rocket that looks like a cartoon illustration have a small drill that turns eats away dirt miles away from it and turns London into a fiery mess. Just sitting here I could come up with a better idea, why not make the blast be the reason the city will be destroyed. Instead of the stupid idea that a ship smaller than Apollo 11 somehow burns an area of 9 miles^2... for fuel?
43:00-44:00 The Doctor says some random words and suddenly Donna unlocks her memory. She puts her hands to her side after saying Binary, Binary, Binary and suddenly she has the time lord regeneration effect. She complains about giving away her money and its some how Tennich's fault.
44:00-45:00 We get that "I am a Doctor" music as Donna pushes buttons and spouts out techno babble. Why could Tennich just tell her what buttons to press? They wasted 2 minutes having an "emotional scene" when tennich could have told her to press the buttons and she could have done it. Why did she need to unlock a timelord's brain to press buttons, when there was clearly enough time for David just to tell her what to press.
45:26 As the spaceship goes back towards the ground the cracks that were formed in London with fire magically patch themselves. But the guy with the Christopher Ecceleston icon told me it was good! They are cartoons made for children that make more sense than this.
46:10 Plot hole Donna asks Tennich "Why has this face come back" there is no reason she should know this. Also during Russel's own series 4 Tennich regenerated into himself again.
46:20 Another crying emotional scene where Donna is "totally dead" even though we had one just a few minutes ago.
Russel cant even let his emotional moment stick because the brainwashed UNIT soldiers arrive to kill Tennich and he says "You were beaten by the Doctor-Donna". They of course dont shoot right away, but let Tennich say his lines. Of course they suddenly get un brainwashed by someone flipping a switch.
47:00-48:00 Somehow Jacob managed to turn off the Meep's mind control device. Because the meta cris passed onto Donna's child and Donna regenerates again. Donna's child also has golden glowing eyes to really show the point. Donna's child also says Non Binary as Donna says binary. The toys he makes and sells online are memories of series 4. They also have this upbeat moment where Donna, and her child, Tennich 2.0 say "The Doctor is male and female, both, and neither."
48:00-49:00 More over bearing music were everyone has their quippy one liners.
49:00-51:00 The Meep is arrested by the green bug men as the unit soldiers stand around. While the meep sequel baits talking about its boss, the doctor makes a quirky comment but doesnt care. Donna and her child say female-presenting timelords can just let thing go. I guess if Tennich said he was a woman he could do it. We get "woman are better than men" and also "anyone can be a woman" at the same time. So a bunch of golden timelord energy leaves them as everyone stands around and asks "What is going on in this stupid script made by Fathead". So much time that could be explained by the plot wasted on repeating the same point from prior. Donna's child says "I am finally me".
51:00-57:00 Donna agrees to one trip with the Doctor to visit Wilf. Donna mocks her husband saying "Lots of men would be worried with me being in a box with a well dressed man." Her husband already being metaphorically castrated says "Not with him." Tennich shows off new tardis like a child and Donna also screams and they call it gorgeous. The lights change colors now and we are wasting time having Tennich explain that the tardis is new to us. We also have a tardis coffee machine. Doctor Who the Science fiction show were we spend the end of the episode having Donna tell the doctor to have friends and visit her from some tea. Out of no where the tardis catches on fire and takes off.
I watched this with a classic who fan who is a Muslim. Russel's "progressive" show did not go over well with him, he had rather harsh things to say about this episode. Things that I can not repeat here. Wasn't this man supposed to make Doctor Who for the working class? It clearly hasn't gone over well with that demographic.
Wasnt this supposed to be for casuals? If I didnt watch series 4 which came out over an decade ago I would be confused as to what is happening. How is this for the common person? How is this for kids? What kid can understand this? Why is Donna going to die? Its not explained other than a brief 30 second introduction by tennich and it was convoluted in the actual episode it appeared in and Russel thinks kids can make sense of it because he had a throw away line saying "Donna cant remember me or she dies". If one doesnt understand the moronic idea of the meta crisis this episode makes 0 sense. This is worse than Season 24 because the low budget actually forced the crew to try to make the show make sense instead of this obnoxious jumping around from one stupid idea to the next. This episode feels like a series of tik toks. Anyone here who liked this go look into a mirror and tell me the plot of this story and then tell me its good.
Why are we making stories based off a weekly comics from the 80s? They are dozens of worthy books to get an adaptation, but we are now remaking filler for a comic?
Episodes that are better than this:
Twin Dilemma
Dimensions in Time
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Post by rushy on Nov 26, 2023 4:47:29 GMT
the Doctor would rather play football than see the dying Brigadier I've never really understood writing the Brigadier's death into the episode (especially on a reboot show where we've never seen him, in a plot unrelated to UNIT). Every single companion the Doctor's ever had dies at some point. Why should he feel bad about telephoning the Brigadier after his passing? Yeah, it's morbid but you can just telephone him 2 years earlier and chat all you want. |
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Post by Spark Doll King on Nov 26, 2023 8:42:02 GMT
the Doctor would rather play football than see the dying Brigadier I've never really understood writing the Brigadier's death into the episode (especially on a reboot show where we've never seen him, in a plot unrelated to UNIT). Every single companion the Doctor's ever had dies at some point. Why should he feel bad about telephoning the Brigadier after his passing? Yeah, it's morbid but you can just telephone him 2 years earlier and chat all you want. I never got nuwhos obsession with making the Doctor omnipresent in every one of his companions lives after they meets, sometimes past as well as future. The Doctor is himself an adventure. You join him, travel with him, then part ways. You will likely never see him again, but the time you spent together will always be with you. That's how it was done in the classic era Now days the Doctor is almost like a cosmic noise friend or life long stalker. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Nov 26, 2023 9:58:53 GMT
Nostalgia is blinding the entire fandom except for Iank who has maintained his clarity. Thanks for excoriating this pile of rubbish, but my posts on this thread have hardly been flattering…🤣 |
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Post by burrunjor on Nov 26, 2023 10:18:08 GMT
Nostalgia is blinding the entire fandom except for Iank who has maintained his clarity. Thanks for excoriating this pile of rubbish, but my posts on this thread have hardly been flattering…🤣 Yeah did he not see my thread absolutely eviscerating it too? I do my best damn it. |
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Post by RobFilth on Nov 26, 2023 10:56:59 GMT
Nostalgia is blinding the entire fandom except for Iank who has maintained his clarity. Thanks for excoriating this pile of rubbish, but my posts on this thread have hardly been flattering…🤣 A very good demolition job done by medicusitic with many excellent points, I particularly like the observations that it "feels like a series of tik toks" and "Its a show written for Tumblr girls." because that IS Fathead and THE template for all of NuWho completely in a nutshell. Throw away shit for a disposable attention deficit generation. I think the only reason why I'm so charitable toward the episode is because of pure nostalgia toward the comic strip(which is why I can forgive the Meeps cartoon spaceship because at least it's faithful toward the source material), and also purely because it doesn't have the Mork paedosuit Faketor gurning her way through the entire episode who I could not bear to watch for more than a few seconds without feeling the urgent and violent impulse to put my boot through the screen. Of course under ANY slight scrutiny, ALL of Fathead T Davies episodes quickly fall apart, they are the televisual equivilent of fast food, without any substance(apart from that which he steals from other sources) and quick to consume but ultimately unsatisfying. Although there were elements I liked in the episode, it's highly doubtful I will be in any rush to rewatch or revisit it. |
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Post by burrunjor on Nov 26, 2023 11:12:17 GMT
Viewers are 5.01 million. Extremely poor for a an opener and a big anniversary episode that has been hyped out of existence, with a return of the most popular New Who Doctor, and that was on before Strictly that got about 8 million. It's only going to go down from there into the 4 millions, which even in this day and age were still seen as crisis period for Jodie. RTD's goose is cooked. twitter.com/i/status/1728631162015211580Why have all the viewers gone? What could have happened! PS I know I posted the meme of it, but it's soooo much worse with the smug/wooden delivery. |
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Post by arthurstengos on Nov 26, 2023 11:14:41 GMT
I watched it and I don’t really know what to make of it. It was all basically running about with flashy special effects and Murray Gold’s bombastic farty brass band music which I detest. I much prefer the synth scores which are more atmospheric.
I really don’t care about Doctor Who anymore to the point that’s I’ve lost interest. The usual Woke nonsense in the scripts are becoming tiring and embarrassing to the point I just laugh at them. The good points are that David Tennant’s portrayal of The Doctor wasn’t as annoying as I thought he was going to be and the new Tardis interior is very good.
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Post by burrunjor on Nov 26, 2023 11:24:48 GMT
I watched it and I don’t really know what to make of it. It was all basically running about with flashy special effects and Murray Gold’s bombastic farty brass band music which I detest. I much prefer the synth scores which are more atmospheric. I really don’t care about Doctor Who anymore to the point that’s I’ve lost interest. The usual Woke nonsense in the scripts are becoming tiring and embarrassing to the point I just laugh at them. The good points are that David Tennant’s portrayal of The Doctor wasn’t as annoying as I thought he was going to be and the new Tardis interior is very good. To be honest watching that last night helped to kill my love for DW. It's funny because this year I rekindled my love for it and had a rewatch from late Troughton to mid Tom and f*cking loved it. Even got back into doing my alternate who sequel series. However watching new who again, honestly made me a bit embarrassed to say I like it, and depressed at how far it's fallen and thinking, you know it's really not worth it. Still hearing how its viewers were crap has cheered me up a bit. Whilst I don't take pleasure in others downfall, it does perhaps mean that maybe the Fitzroy Crowd's hold over the franchise is beginning to collapse. How can they go on? This was their last throw of the dice. Surely? |
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Post by Monster X on Nov 26, 2023 11:31:33 GMT
Why are we making stories based off a weekly comics from the 80s? They are dozens of worthy books to get an adaptation, but we are now remaking filler for a comic? was originally created by writers Pat Mills, John Wagner and artist Dave Gibbons - three giants of the UK comics scene. The story itself is a well written, humourous, beautifully illustrated comic strip from the early days of Doctor Who Weekly and is fondly remembered by many older fans. The comics medium is definitely a ' worthy' source of inspiration - comic books and graphic novels can often be more intelligent, and have more depth, power and entertainment value than an awful lot of films, novels or television shows . If Davies' adaptation of ' The Star Beast' fails (and it does, spectacularly), then it's not the fault of the original comic strip or its creators. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Nov 26, 2023 11:55:16 GMT
A brief addendum. My brother also watched it and was nonplused by it.
He said to me at the end: “Why couldn’t they have brought McGann back instead of Tennant? Tennant’s dominated it for years and McGann was wasted in one film”.
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Post by burrunjor on Nov 26, 2023 11:59:11 GMT
A brief addendum. My brother also watched it and was nonplused by it. He said to me at the end: “Why couldn’t they have brought McGann back instead of Tennant? Tennant’s dominated it for years and McGann was wasted in one film”. How do you think the failure of this will affect RTD's legacy in the long run. This truly does change everything now. His followers can no longer rely on the "he just understands DW" or "DW is all about change" "New Who was more popular than classic who" mantras. All of those things have been truly debunked by now. I genuinely think the narrative will change to "yeah new who was good for its time, but doesn't hold up as much now." |
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