Anyone got the poll results?

[iank]

Hunh?

That makes no sense whatsover. What a load of bull.

[rushy]

Why?

[Deleted]

I don't think either of them should be that high. It amuses me to see Capaldi fans gloating about it and making the claim that the poll results confirm that Capaldi wasn't let down by bad writing. He had several blockbuster efforts, but he also had some outrageously shite episodes too and nothing will change that. Literally the only episode my mum can even remember is "the one where he's in the castle." Nothing else from the era made any sort of impression on her and even my sister, who watched it a lot during the Smith years, gave it up during Series 9.

[Deleted]

The biggest WTF entry is Day of the Doctor, though. That's unquestionably shit. Fandom honestly has the nerve to pick on The Three Doctors while praising that heap of NuWho fanwank.

[rushy]

Day of the Doctor is... questionable, but Three Doctors borders on incompetent TV worthy of the worst of the 80s.

[iank]

I think the entire thing has about the same legitimacy as the 2020 US Presidential election.

[ClockworkOcean]

Heaven Sent has merit when considered in isolation, but the fact that it ties into the atrocious Hell Bent and Moffat's narcissistic Hybrid narrative immediately disqualifies it from being top-tier Doctor Who. A story that doesn't respect its own message enough not to spend the next episode completely undermining it doesn't deserve to be here.

World Enough and Time has an interesting premise, some well-executed atmospheric horror, and a decent portrayal of the Mondassian Cybermen. Sadly, it also has Missy, man-hating dialogue, jokes about the Master's erect penis, and an "everybody lives" deus ex machina ending that's nauseatingly saccharine even by NuWho standards. People look back on this story through rose-tinted glasses because it's the last one before NuWho went past the point of no return, but it's deeply flawed. No f*cking way does it belong in the top ten.

Day of the Doctor? Meh, it's a fun bit of high-budget pomp and spectacle with some great performances but not much more. Hype over substance. Bringing back Gallifrey with no plan to do anything other than use it to troll fans by shoehorning Clara into the Doctor's origin story even more was an idiotic move.

I don't object that strongly to Blink making the top ten. I wouldn't choose it myself, but it's the only NuWho inclusion so far that isn't completely absurd.

Human Nature falls apart after a moment's analysis. The Doctor's actions are illogical and morally indefensible. Deciding that endangering the lives of hundreds of schoolboys and condemning Martha to a life of racist servitude would be preferable to killing a few monsters in self-defense, only to then subject those same monsters to ETERNAL TORTURE out of spite? f*ck off Cornell.

Silence in the Library is alright. Some imaginative sci-fi horror concepts, but too many Moffat clichés for my liking, and the River Song stuff hasn't aged well. I wouldn't vote for it myself (unless the poll were exclusive to NuWho), but don't find its inclusion completely outrageous either.

All in all, an absolutely dismal result. Any top ten list without a single Hartnell, Troughton or Pertwee story is f*cking tragic, and a damning confirmation of just how little the current crop of "fans" give a shit about the history of the series. FFS, if you're going to have a NuWho-dominated list, at least include a healthy dose of Smith episodes. I'm glad that Genesis, Caves, Remembrance and City of Death made it, but where's The Seeds of Doom? Talons? The Daleks? Inferno? The War Games? State of Decay? The Deadly Assassin? Fenric? The Mind Robber? What a joke.

[iank]

To be fair to Cornell, most of those illogical and morally indefensible story choices are entirely the TV version (which RTD likes to boast he completely rewrote) and not at all in the book, so I think we can guess who's to blame for that nonsense.

The sad reality though is that the real show has been almost entirely subsumed and replaced by the modern forgery. Go on YT and look up Who and 99% of what comes up is the modern bollocks. Our show has been hijacked and replaced by trash. It should never have "come back". 

[Deleted]

Sorry, but are the full results coming out? I've just had a look at what's in tomorrow's issue and there's still nothing about it. Did they seriously plan on just showing us the top ten?

[iank]

Probably. I think we can guess whose stories came last, so they'll probably never show it.

[burrunjor]

Nov 15, 2023 0:50:30 GMT ClockworkOcean said:

Heaven Sent has merit when considered in isolation, but the fact that it ties into the atrocious Hell Bent and Moffat's narcissistic Hybrid narrative immediately disqualifies it from being top-tier Doctor Who. A story that doesn't respect its own message enough not to spend the next episode completely undermining it doesn't deserve to be here.

World Enough and Time has an interesting premise, some well-executed atmospheric horror, and a decent portrayal of the Mondassian Cybermen. Sadly, it also has Missy, man-hating dialogue, jokes about the Master's erect penis, and an "everybody lives" deus ex machina ending that's nauseatingly saccharine even by NuWho standards. People look back on this story through rose-tinted glasses because it's the last one before NuWho went past the point of no return, but it's deeply flawed. No f*cking way does it belong in the top ten.

Day of the Doctor? Meh, it's a fun bit of high-budget pomp and spectacle with some great performances but not much more. Hype over substance. Bringing back Gallifrey with no plan to do anything other than use it to troll fans by shoehorning Clara into the Doctor's origin story even more was an idiotic move.

I don't object that strongly to Blink making the top ten. I wouldn't choose it myself, but it's the only NuWho inclusion so far that isn't completely absurd.

Human Nature falls apart after a moment's analysis. The Doctor's actions are illogical and morally indefensible. Deciding that endangering the lives of hundreds of schoolboys and condemning Martha to a life of racist servitude would be preferable to killing a few monsters in self-defense, only to then subject those same monsters to ETERNAL TORTURE out of spite? f*ck off Cornell.

Silence in the Library is alright. Some imaginative sci-fi horror concepts, but too many Moffat clichés for my liking, and the River Song stuff hasn't aged well. I wouldn't vote for it myself (unless the poll were exclusive to NuWho), but don't find its inclusion completely outrageous either.

All in all, an absolutely dismal result. Any top ten list without a single Hartnell, Troughton or Pertwee story is f*cking tragic, and a damning confirmation of just how little the current crop of "fans" give a shit about the history of the series. FFS, if you're going to have a NuWho-dominated list, at least include a healthy dose of Smith episodes. I'm glad that Genesis, Caves, Remembrance and City of Death made it, but where's The Seeds of Doom? Talons? The Daleks? Inferno? The War Games? State of Decay? The Deadly Assassin? Fenric? The Mind Robber? What a joke.

I really don't appreciate you as much as I should LOL. 

That is the perfect summation of everything wrong with that turgid list. Can't believe I missed this the first time. Bravo. 

[Deleted]

Jan 4, 2024 9:54:45 GMT burrunjor said:

Nov 15, 2023 0:50:30 GMT ClockworkOcean said:

Heaven Sent has merit when considered in isolation, but the fact that it ties into the atrocious Hell Bent and Moffat's narcissistic Hybrid narrative immediately disqualifies it from being top-tier Doctor Who. A story that doesn't respect its own message enough not to spend the next episode completely undermining it doesn't deserve to be here.

World Enough and Time has an interesting premise, some well-executed atmospheric horror, and a decent portrayal of the Mondassian Cybermen. Sadly, it also has Missy, man-hating dialogue, jokes about the Master's erect penis, and an "everybody lives" deus ex machina ending that's nauseatingly saccharine even by NuWho standards. People look back on this story through rose-tinted glasses because it's the last one before NuWho went past the point of no return, but it's deeply flawed. No f*cking way does it belong in the top ten.

Day of the Doctor? Meh, it's a fun bit of high-budget pomp and spectacle with some great performances but not much more. Hype over substance. Bringing back Gallifrey with no plan to do anything other than use it to troll fans by shoehorning Clara into the Doctor's origin story even more was an idiotic move.

I don't object that strongly to Blink making the top ten. I wouldn't choose it myself, but it's the only NuWho inclusion so far that isn't completely absurd.

Human Nature falls apart after a moment's analysis. The Doctor's actions are illogical and morally indefensible. Deciding that endangering the lives of hundreds of schoolboys and condemning Martha to a life of racist servitude would be preferable to killing a few monsters in self-defense, only to then subject those same monsters to ETERNAL TORTURE out of spite? f*ck off Cornell.

Silence in the Library is alright. Some imaginative sci-fi horror concepts, but too many Moffat clichés for my liking, and the River Song stuff hasn't aged well. I wouldn't vote for it myself (unless the poll were exclusive to NuWho), but don't find its inclusion completely outrageous either.

All in all, an absolutely dismal result. Any top ten list without a single Hartnell, Troughton or Pertwee story is f*cking tragic, and a damning confirmation of just how little the current crop of "fans" give a shit about the history of the series. FFS, if you're going to have a NuWho-dominated list, at least include a healthy dose of Smith episodes. I'm glad that Genesis, Caves, Remembrance and City of Death made it, but where's The Seeds of Doom? Talons? The Daleks? Inferno? The War Games? State of Decay? The Deadly Assassin? Fenric? The Mind Robber? What a joke.

I really don't appreciate you as much as I should LOL. 

That is the perfect summation of everything wrong with that turgid list. Can't believe I missed this the first time. Bravo. 

I'd have Talons in there personally. Problem is, I don't see it getting in the top ten ever again. I often feel like you'd be cross examined by certain people in fandom (yeah, those ones) if you admitted you liked it. 

[Deleted]

If Orphan 55 isn't dead last then I'm not only divorcing myself from this fandom, but also this entire planet.

[mott1]

Nov 9, 2023 13:38:44 GMT @theyakemperor said:

Nov 9, 2023 13:32:34 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

I watched the first part of World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls earlier. Some of it is very silly like Missy doing a dab and that stupid, "Doctor Who" nonsense which isn't as funny as Moffat thinks it is. I do however like the horror of it and as a lover of the Mondasian Cybermen I enjoy their return very much. I've always maintained they're the creepiest Cybermen. It's a highlight of Capaldi's run for sure, but second best story ever made? As Monster X says, it's not even in the same league as Caves of Androzani. I still think Remembrance is the best of the lot and I'm happy its place in the top ten is going to prove the "McCoy was the nadir of the series" wrong once again. Where's a story from the "superior" Eccleston era in the top ten?  I can't see it anywhere 

I think McCoy is in the clear nowadays, especially as he seems to be popular with hipsters. It's Colin Baker that people tend to pile on, and even he's getting more love now. To tell a truth, I've been rewatching series 22 recently, episodes I haven't watched for many years, and have been really enjoying it. It's obviously cheap tat, but somehow genuinely compelling. The speech the governor gives to the captain of the guard in Vengeance on Varos was actually really well-written and captivating. I just wish it had received the budget it needed. Although, there is something charming about the wobbly sets and thrown-together design elements, it actually makes it creepier in some respects.

Martin Jarvis played the Governor, didn't he? Always a reliable actor. And the different production methods of the time give different eras their unique tones. You can't really imagine a traditional Hartnell tale in the mid/late 70s, or a season 7 or early Tom-era creepfest in the late 80s (Tho Fenric had its moments!)

And I agree on Day Of The Doctor. How it keeps getting in 'best of' polls is beyond me - all I really remember of it now is Tennant being a bellend (again), Tom's cameo and the comedy zygon - what a comedown for one of the show's most unsettling creatures.

[Deleted]

Jan 4, 2024 12:52:58 GMT mott1 said:

Nov 9, 2023 13:38:44 GMT @theyakemperor said:

I think McCoy is in the clear nowadays, especially as he seems to be popular with hipsters. It's Colin Baker that people tend to pile on, and even he's getting more love now. To tell a truth, I've been rewatching series 22 recently, episodes I haven't watched for many years, and have been really enjoying it. It's obviously cheap tat, but somehow genuinely compelling. The speech the governor gives to the captain of the guard in Vengeance on Varos was actually really well-written and captivating. I just wish it had received the budget it needed. Although, there is something charming about the wobbly sets and thrown-together design elements, it actually makes it creepier in some respects.

Martin Jarvis played the Governor, didn't he? Always a reliable actor. And the different production methods of the time give different eras their unique tones. You can't really imagine a traditional Hartnell tale in the mid/late 70s, or a season 7 or early Tom-era creepfest in the late 80s (Tho Fenric had its moments!)

And I agree on Day Of The Doctor. How it keeps getting in 'best of' polls is beyond me - all I really remember of it now is Tennant being a bellend (again), Tom's cameo and the comedy zygon - what a comedown for one of the show's most unsettling creatures.

I was sad they stopped doing those creepfest stories. I think Stones of Blood and State of Decay were the last ones for a long while. Ghost Light and Fenric did very well to resurrect the spirit of those late Hinchcliffe/early Williams gothic horrors.