The 60th Anniversary Specials

[rushy]

Probably to keep himself active within the fan community, build solidarity with the largely left-wing viewership the show has accumulated.

[burrunjor]

You mean get dopamine hits from having his arse kissed by the largely, upper middle class, identity politics obsessed, neo liberal creepy cult the fandom has become in the last 10 years because the neo lib hypocritical psycho's bullied everyone else out of THEIR fandom?

[rushy]

It's the safest of safe spaces, so safe that nobody else fits in lol s

[burrunjor]

Oct 6, 2023 17:02:36 GMT rushy said:

It's the safest of safe spaces, so safe that nobody else fits in lol s

Look here's what another fan was told today by the BeKind mob for daring to criticise RTD and Josh Snares. 

[Spark Doll King]

Oct 6, 2023 19:44:48 GMT burrunjor said:

Oct 6, 2023 17:02:36 GMT rushy said:

It's the safest of safe spaces, so safe that nobody else fits in lol s

Look here's what another fan was told today by the BeKind mob for daring to criticise RTD and Josh Snares. 

"You are a sad, strange little man, and I bid you farewell."

Best response to people who are empathetically deficient.

[iank]

These are the people running the show, and obsessed with it.
It's not made for anyone with working brain cells anymore.

[Deleted]

That sort of scummy behaviour really puts me off the show. Who fans sent JNT to an early grave, seems as though they'll do it to someone else again eventually.

[Deleted]

As I said yesterday, this is the typical cult-like suicide vest behaviour I'd expect from the Snyder brigade.

[burrunjor]

Oct 6, 2023 22:08:42 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

That sort of scummy behaviour really puts me off the show. Who fans sent JNT to an early grave, seems as though they'll do it to someone else again eventually.

I know what you mean. Seeing that and just the relentless, obnoxiousness from fans on social media like Josh Snares and comments like "why do heterosexual people even watch DW." "There's no place for conservatives in DW." It honestly is enough to make you not want to bother with the show, because it really does come over as a little neo liberals only club now. Again though the ones I despise the most of all are the Anorak Zone type fans, the Servobots, the Ginger Cats, the middle aged saddos who think that's what the young crowd are into and who go along with that no matter what, and who STILL go on about JNT. 

It makes me laugh when I saw, just before my ban on Anorak Zone, someone saying "oh don't worry it's not like the 90s where the show was a joke and its fandom was viewed as an exclusive club for losers and saddos."

Are you f*cking kidding me! It's that now more than ever. In the 90s it was just a sci fi show that was no longer on the air, but fondly remembered and had a bit of a stigma because it was sci fi. Now, it's seen as a cult where if you don't bend the knee, you get to told to kill yourself! However again the edgelords on the Anorak Zone would never admit that because Oh dear, that might mean criticising aspects of the LGBT/female/millennial side of fandom and they don't want to be seen as gammons. It's absolutely pathetic.  (Even more so when they are genuinely misogynistic in other ways, that won't get them into as much trouble.)

[Deleted]

What is the deal with this Josh Snares guy anyway? I watched some of his missing episode documentaries years back, but I didn't realize he was a relevant figure in fandom.

[burrunjor]

Oct 6, 2023 22:33:38 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

What is the deal with this Josh Snares guy anyway? I watched some of his missing episode documentaries years back, but I didn't realize he was a relevant figure in fandom.

He's the new official custodian of fandom it would seem. The Fitzroy Crowd wanted a new millennial, Gen Z fan to be the face of fandom to show how woke and hip and cool it was for a while. (Though one who would obviously bend the knee and NEVER question them.) Mr Tardis was never in the running because he was a white straight man, too toxic and would probably get the BBC sued if he actually represented the company and kept calling people pedos and holocaust deniers and rapists with no evidence. Claudia Boleyn was eyed up with the Time Team, but she didn't bend the knee and so was quietly dropped in an ironically misogynistic way. Christel Dee seemed to be the best candidate as she was charming or at least acceptable and inoffensive to most of fandom, but she soon went onto new pastures. (Clever girl.) 

Josh Snares therefore became their guy. He's certainly not even a billionth as bad as Mr Tardis. I mean I've never had any run ins with him, and he does some good work, like that Genocide Machine animation. However he is a bit up himself. Not only does he bring politics into DW a lot, but he also rarely interacts with his fans or people. I'm not saying he has too, I mean we all have limited time, and you never know who is a potential stalker out there. Still he constantly moans about fans wanting to speak with him, about how he has no interest in speaking with fans unless they are content creators. I might add I've have some unbelievably wonderful conversations with ACTUAL celebs online. Ferne McCann talked to me about my niece and our struggles with mental health on her insta page in the comments and she is the star of a tv show with millions of viewers. Dana DeLorenzo comforted me about my Uncle dying (as sadly her mom had also just passed from cancer) and Shobna Gulati liked being compared to Stacy's Mom haha. Josh Snares meanwhile isn't even a f*cking celebrity and he acts like f*cking Ringo telling his fans not to write to him. He really is a classic example of small name big ego it would seem. He also frequently makes out Who fandom are homophobic for stupid reasons.

Recently however he went on a probably drunken rant, saying he wouldn't be happy until all conservatives jumped in a hole and died and that he hoped they would hang. He was banned by X for hate speech and the entire DW fandom that has got others like James Drefyus and Gareth Roberts fired and blacklisted instantly started complaining about free speech, leading to the clash above. 

Glinner even jumped in on it. To be clear I do despise Glinner and think he IS a bigot who has helped demonise trans people, but it shows you how notorious Who fandom is. Glinner also for some reason thinks Gatiss is the overlord of fandom, asking him if he is going to do anything about the anti feminist, misogynistic mess DW fandom has become. Seriously? The anti feminist mess? Gatiss hasn't even written for the show in six years, and was always arguably the least offensive member of the crowd. He certainly of all of the actual writers is possibly the only one NOT responsible for its current state. RTD brought in the clique, Moff spinelessly handed it over to the SJWs to avoid being called a sexist, Chibnall was Chibnall, Cornell pushed the all about change bullshit and bullied people, Briggs turned Big Finish into the punchline it is today, Gary Russell revised and changed the animated stories to be more PC. What did Gatiss do?

Gatiss wasn't even a c*nt to fans, or to people who didn't want a female Doctor like Robert Shearman was? 
 

[Deleted]

Oct 6, 2023 22:31:39 GMT burrunjor said:

Oct 6, 2023 22:08:42 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

That sort of scummy behaviour really puts me off the show. Who fans sent JNT to an early grave, seems as though they'll do it to someone else again eventually.

I know what you mean. Seeing that and just the relentless, obnoxiousness from fans on social media like Josh Snares and comments like "why do heterosexual people even watch DW." "There's no place for conservatives in DW." It honestly is enough to make you not want to bother with the show, because it really does come over as a little neo liberals only club now. 

Ah, I know which fans you mean: the sort who only know of Jon Pertwee via reference books and YouTube videos, and who would probably raise their eyebrows in befuddlement were you to say the names "Roger Delgado", "Terry Nation", "Waris Hussein", "Terrance Dicks", etc. to them. The sort who would probably cringe at Bill Hartnell episodes because "muh black and white, racist old man mememememe" and would probably ship Two and Jamie when they got to their episodes. The sort who wouldn't even watch Jodie's episodes because they were too shit but praised them idly from the sidelines nonetheless, only to cannibalise Chibnall and team (white men, ew) and excusing Jodie's poor portrayal because of it, essentially dressing the elephant in the room up as a wardrobe and trying to pass it off. The sort who literally, and I know this is overstated but we all know it's true, don't understand any of the characters, their histories or how they're supposed to be portrayed, not realising that constant subversion of the past does nothing but damage the dynamic of the show. The sort who dress like f*cking babies, have never worked a day in their life yet crave a communist revolution, have no understanding of the world, no moral framework, no sense of right and wrong, no purpose.

That's the dominant force in fandom today. Give me misogynistic anorak-wearing geeks any day, not that I've ever even encountered one, but they must exist since they're talked about so much! Ironically, it's a lot like the plot of RTD's Army of Ghosts; these "toxic fans" are being willed into existence as an entirely imaginary malevolent force from which a throng of narcissistic chancers can essentially harvest sociopolitical power. Of course, the majority of this "sort" are simply useful idiots in the employ of a greater power, but there are a few in the know; I'd even argue guys like Chibnall and RTD are merely failed big boys left clutching the lower rungs of the ladder, made to dance for the spectacle of the public eye. This coming era will be no different. Panem et circenses, as they say.

[rushy]

Lmfao at this:

[Deleted]

I've never understood why some people need to be fully represented in a show in order to become interested in it.

[burrunjor]

Oct 7, 2023 8:55:58 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

I've never understood why some people need to be fully represented in a show in order to become interested in it.

Well I understand it in some ways. I didn't use to, but I came round to it in some respects. 

1/ Little boys and little girls do need heroes to look up, or hell even villains to want to pretend to be when playing with their friends LOL. (More kids probably wanted to be the Daleks than the Doctor.) Now I'm not saying you can't look up to a female hero, but obviously it is easier for a little boy to pretend to be a male hero, and a little girl to pretend to be a female hero. That's just the way most people are. Hence why things with male heroes tend to be more popular among little boys, and things with female heroes tend to be more popular among little girls. 

2/ If you are part of a minority that is being persecuted, then obviously seeing someone like you being treated as a normal person will make you feel better, that you're not a freak, that it's possible to have a normal life. 

For all of these reasons, when creating my own universe of characters, I am more than happy to have a wide range of diverse characters. I have black heroes, gay heroes, even a trans character. (Who is based on a real life trans woman, Rachel Humphry's the girlfriend of Lou Reed. I always found their relationship because of how ahead of its time it was fascinating, and after my own romantic experience with a trans person, it became something I could relate too, so that inspired me.) 

However the problem with these diversity nutcases on twitter and the ego centric  producers who pander to them like RTD and J J Abrams (god I must be pissing off Rushy LOL. He can do a post saying Amy Winehouse and Katey Sagal suck in response LOL.) 

The problem with their diversity is

1/ They don't write these people as proper, fully rounded characters with a diverse range of interests, motivations, back stories or foes. They define them entirely by those characteristics all of the time, and they use the characters to insult white men all the time in a misguided belief that that's what women and black people want to see, or perhaps more cynically to try and whip up a response from angry fans, who they can then smear as misogynists in order to look like they are progressive. A great way of looking progressive without doing a sodding thing. The idea that they and their shills like Mr Tardis compare themselves to the likes of Gene Roddenberry who actually DID make a stand and had black people in his work when it was a genuinely brave and bold thing to do is disgusting. They are undoing the work that Gene Roddenberry and others like him did, by making black characters automatically divisive.

(To be fair I am not saying that you can't bring persecution and bigotry into things. If you're setting something in 60s bible belt America, then yeah absolutely you can mention the widespread racism like Umbrella Academy did. However they want to crowbar it into anything, even things that are set in fantasy worlds where it just doesn't fit. For instance why the f*ck should Supergirl comment on women's lib?  Does Batman address issues facing men like loneliness? As I've said before having that attitude towards female heroes is actually old fashioned. It reminds me of Alan Partridge saying to the female politician "I don't know you want to talk about women or something?"

2/ They want to cram diversity into every f*cking story. Sometimes it doesn't work because the story has to be told from a certain dynamic. For instance Bottom only works with two men, similarly Xena works with two women. You can't make everything diverse. Meanwhile characters like the Doctor, Batman etc, have a particular set of key/core characteristics that people think define them, and yeah their gender may be a part of that as it is an important of everyone, even, especially trans people's personalities. Even their race might be an important part of that, as a characters appearance can be part of their personality, and yes that's a two way street. Blade for instance couldn't be a white man, or a Chinese guy, even though there is NOTHING in his personality or story that stipulates he must be black. Visually we are too used to him as a black guy. It just wouldn't look right

Rather than discuss each character on a case by case basis, measure the pros and cons of changing them, looking at little ways you can get by it, IE make out this is a loose remake so it's not impinging on the original etc. They just want to trample over every character with their size 12s to make them diverse, which often leads to the diverse version being like a square peg fitting a round hole. 

Sadly the end result of all this is a genuine backlash against diversity and young people wanting to have heroes they can look up too. We just have to hope cooler heads prevail and that in a few years time we aren't the ones arguing that a female led thing can be profitable to these Hollywood wankers who have jumped ship to a new fad.