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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2022 16:15:44 GMT
Considered the two greatest stories of the 1980s, Caves and Remembrance frequently end up in top 10 favourite polls. I've warmed to Androzani and while I think it's pretty good, I don't think it's nearly on the same level as Remembrance. Remembrance is so much more investing and generally looks more appealing. Ace is a better companion than Nicola "I couldn't act my way out of a Tesco's shopping bag" Bryant and the action is absolutely sublime. I also like that the story isn't dark and depressing and instead reinvents the series with a confident swagger, thrilling the audience with continuity references and glossy set pieces.
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Post by burrunjor on Jan 20, 2022 16:17:45 GMT
Remembrance and it is not even close. It's better in every way to be honest. Acting, script, pacing, and production values.
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mistressrani
Certified Mob Rallying Heretic Crank
"Ignore me, I'm a dickhead." Rob Filth, 2021
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Post by mistressrani on Jan 20, 2022 16:21:17 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2022 16:34:12 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature. It was the 25th anniversary season. The viewer should expect continuity references. Most of the references wouldn't harm a casual viewer's enjoyment of the story anyway. |
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mistressrani
Certified Mob Rallying Heretic Crank
"Ignore me, I'm a dickhead." Rob Filth, 2021
Posts: 129
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Post by mistressrani on Jan 20, 2022 16:43:30 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature. It was the 25th anniversary season. The viewer should expect continuity references. Most of the references wouldn't harm a casual viewer's enjoyment of the story anyway. Yeah, the fan in me likes them but I don't think they generally enhance a story, hence I feel Caves is the better story. |
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Post by UncleDeadly on Jan 20, 2022 17:07:14 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature. Fokk me, i think i agree with this. Hold on, i need to have a lie down... |
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Post by burrunjor on Jan 20, 2022 17:08:47 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature. I can see why you'd say that but I don't think that the continuity references in Remembrance jump out at you too much. They kind of go over your head like Ace reading the book if you're not a die hard fan. Similarly the two women being like Barbara and Liz goes over your head if you don't know those characters, but for us we can recognise them. Caves is still a classic, don't get me wrong, but Remembrance is just such fun and has a great story and great characters. (Maybe though I am just projecting as we had some issues with a guy named Mike who joined a dodgy political cult, so I can relate to it more. "I didn't know it was nonces sir.") |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Jan 20, 2022 17:11:15 GMT
Caves - better in almost every regard - acting, characterisation, not weighed down by continuity that alienates the casual viewer and just generally more gripping and innovative. It's only let down by the magma creature. This must be an official first, but I actually completely agree with you on this, even if I don't take any issue with the continuity references in Remembrance. Caves is phenomenal- the dialogue is superbly Shakespearean and laden with deliciously theatrical black comedy even amidst the inherent tragedy of the story, and the direction consistently inventive, turning to dynamic tracking shots when appropriate and implementing appropriate scene transitions unseen elsewhere in the programme (see the transition from Morgus' to Jek's veneers respectively- a truly chilling moment). Additionally, as good as the side-characters are in Remembrance, Sharaz Jek is one of the best grotesques/tragic heroes ever presented in the series, and the fact that the story presents such a bleak oeuvre of malcontents within a society driven by base urge and cynical consumerism serves as a deliciously apt counterpoint to the otherwise placid Fifth Doctor, truly testing his limits. |
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Post by RobFilth on Jan 20, 2022 18:11:55 GMT
I'm afraid I'm with Rani on this one, I prefer "Caves" purely because the level of the acting is just so darn good and the dialogue(and monologues) are so darn well written.
I do prefer "Remembrance" for it's dalek action scenes and faster moving plot, but "Caves" nudges it for me with it's more adult approach.
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mistressrani
Certified Mob Rallying Heretic Crank
"Ignore me, I'm a dickhead." Rob Filth, 2021
Posts: 129
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Post by mistressrani on Jan 20, 2022 18:56:49 GMT
I'm afraid I'm with Rani on this one, I prefer "Caves" purely because the level of the acting is just so darn good and the dialogue(and monologues) are so darn well written. I do prefer "Remembrance" for it's dalek action scenes and faster moving plot, but "Caves" nudges it for me with it's more adult approach. Welcome back on the Rani Truth Train! |
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Post by iank on Jan 20, 2022 22:21:00 GMT
I prefer Remembrance, it is more fun.
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Post by RobFilth on Jan 20, 2022 22:25:06 GMT
I'm afraid I'm with Rani on this one, I prefer "Caves" purely because the level of the acting is just so darn good and the dialogue(and monologues) are so darn well written. I do prefer "Remembrance" for it's dalek action scenes and faster moving plot, but "Caves" nudges it for me with it's more adult approach. Welcome back on the Rani Truth Train! Even broken clocks are correct twice a day Rani. I don't expect you to make a habit of it. You'll be off that truth train and back into the clown car in no time. |
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mistressrani
Certified Mob Rallying Heretic Crank
"Ignore me, I'm a dickhead." Rob Filth, 2021
Posts: 129
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Post by mistressrani on Jan 21, 2022 10:13:35 GMT
Welcome back on the Rani Truth Train! Even broken clocks are correct twice a day Rani. I don't expect you to make a habit of it. You'll be off that truth train and back into the clown car in no time. Twice a day is still more often than you!  |
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Post by RobFilth on Jan 21, 2022 21:43:56 GMT
Even broken clocks are correct twice a day Rani. I don't expect you to make a habit of it. You'll be off that truth train and back into the clown car in no time. Twice a day is still more often than you! Sheer fiction, I present clear consise evidence based facts to counter the clownish nonsense which you regularly dole out. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2022 22:43:12 GMT
Remembrance is more visually appealing because a lot of it was shot on location in London while Caves is mostly set bound. I also like how Remembrance takes place in the swinging sixties rather than a sandy planet in the middle of nowhere. I like Caves now but Remembrance and indeed Fenric are on a different level.
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