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Post by Cherry Pepsi Maxil on Oct 4, 2024 16:10:59 GMT
I saw this earlier. To be honest I'm not going to sit here and pretend it's a complete disaster. This film is visually striking, perhaps one of the most best-looking films I've seen for ages. The musical numbers are beautifully staged and framed and the lighting is wonderful. Gaga's make up design as well as her performance are highlights though the character feels a bit undercooked. The biggest flaw is Joker himself. This movie is a Joker movie that doesn't want to be a Joker movie. You're not getting the Joker movie you've got in your head. Todd Philips has purposely short-changed the viewers in this way and I think that's the reason people don't like the movie. It also doesn't help that the trial sequences are often quite flat. There are a few great moments within said trial though involving the character of Gary which results in an almost regretful reaction from Arthur. I don't want to get into spoilers until everyone has seen it, but the ending scene works slightly better in context rather than just reading it online. It does feel however like Philips is saying, "aww, screw it. I'm not going to be making more of these films anyway" in the last twenty minutes. You really have to decide for yourself whether or not the film works as both a follow up to the first and also as a piece of entertainment. It fails as the former but sort of suceeds as the latter. The musical elements are actually the best thing about the movie though Philips never goes all out like he should have done. I think that's the best review I've seen of it. Pretty much what I thought that it might be okay in its own right, but it just isn't what you wanted. Really the trailer I posted in this thread I think f*cked them LOL as it completely made out that the movie was the Joker and Gaga going on a rampage throughout Gotham and possibly fighting Batman and got everybody hyped for that. Still I think this will collapse at the box office, but its reputation may improve in time. It amuses me that the Drinker has made a video on his lesser channel with a bunch of other people and half of them haven't even seen the movie. They're still slagging it off, though. It reminds me a bit of Batman Forever. I'm not saying they're at all the same, but with that film it seems universally loathed until you actually look beneath the surface and all of a sudden there's a ton of "Batman Forever is underrated" content from people. Even when looking on IMDB there's several 6/10 reviews for this new Joker film saying it's not a complete misfire. My mum, who doesn't care much about reviews anyway, thought it was perfectly entertaining. I do feel the hate for it is a little extreme. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Oct 4, 2024 17:07:02 GMT
To somewhat redress my prior posts: Whatever myriad problems this film has, I can’t personally see it being worse than Feigbusters, The Last Jedi, The Rise of Skywalker or NuWho at its worst. The fact that the critical/fan-based intelligentsia thinks that it is makes me a tad- if not completely- suspicious.
(That said, I doubt most things are as bad as those cited above…)
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 4, 2024 17:11:29 GMT
I think that's the best review I've seen of it. Pretty much what I thought that it might be okay in its own right, but it just isn't what you wanted. Really the trailer I posted in this thread I think f*cked them LOL as it completely made out that the movie was the Joker and Gaga going on a rampage throughout Gotham and possibly fighting Batman and got everybody hyped for that. Still I think this will collapse at the box office, but its reputation may improve in time. It amuses me that the Drinker has made a video on his lesser channel with a bunch of other people and half of them haven't even seen the movie. They're still slagging it off, though. It reminds me a bit of Batman Forever. I'm not saying they're at all the same, but with that film it seems universally loathed until you actually look beneath the surface and all of a sudden there's a ton of "Batman Forever is underrated" content from people. Even when looking on IMDB there's several 6/10 reviews for this new Joker film saying it's not a complete misfire. My mum, who doesn't care much about reviews anyway, thought it was perfectly entertaining. I do feel the hate for it is a little extreme. That's exactly what I hate about fandom. They are so ridiculous in their hatred for things, and are such an insecure little clique they can't stand anything that might make them look bad or uncool and above all else they love jumping on bandwagons. Regardless if said bandwagons contradict past ones like "Topher Grace ruined Venom for evah, because he wasn't completely faithful, Missy is the best Master of all time despite not having even the smallest similarity to the character." No one should ever think the Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic mob aren't that. The only difference is that they aren't in with the dominant clique, but they are still part of another equally obnoxious little clique that want to take over and neither side actually likes sci fi and fantasy that much. Both just see it as a thing they can exploit for their own ends. Real genre fans need to stop believing both sides bullshit and tell them all to f*ck off. Have you seen Morbius Maxil? Like I said it was the one that finally convinced me that fans are just sheep, because it was hailed as the absolute worst film ever made. It became a standing joke to take the piss out of it. It got so bad the director retweeted a positive review of it that was sarcastic and everybody laughed at him, and Sony re released it thinking that the memes meant it was popular, only for it to flop again after which it got the shit ripped out of it even more, with some people setting up a campaign for it to be released a third time which got hundreds of thousands of signatures, just so it could be humiliated again. I finally watched it because I assumed it would be the worst film ever and it was just an average vampire flick. Nothing bad about it, nothing special, but nothing bad. It was no worse than about 90 percent of MCU movies that these Disney simps in fandom wank over.) I felt cheated at watching an average film rather than something like The Room LOL. Funny thing is none of these people whenever you ask them can say why it's bad. They can't single out any moment of dreadful acting, direction, glaring plot holes, inconsistencies etc. I always can for things I think are bad. For instance Missy you know all the reasons I think she is terrible. Similarly the Room I can point out why it's bad. Morbius it really is just "it's bad, worst film evah." Watch Critical Drinkers review of Morbius to see that. FFS one of the things he takes the piss out of it for, Morbius using bats in his experiments is in the f*cking comic story. Fandom needs changed from top to bottom. |
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Post by Cherry Pepsi Maxil on Oct 4, 2024 21:48:57 GMT
I've not seen Morbius, no. Not because of the negativity, just that I don't really watch superhero stuff anymore. I watch the latest Batman related things, but I'm done with all the others. I can't be bothered with Gunn's Superman and now that Joker is done there's only really the second The Batman to look forward to. Apart from all that I'm perfectly happy with the Reeve Superman flicks, the 1989-1997 Batman films, the two Joker films (on reflection I honestly didn't mind the second one all that much. I'd watch it again), the first Tobey Spider-Man and the first Robert Pattinson Batman (which even then I probably won't watch that often). I don't bother with the MCU and modern DC films. I've only ever seen the first Avengers and I wasn't particularly impressed.
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Post by iank on Oct 5, 2024 6:14:10 GMT
I saw half an hour of Morbius on streaming. It was crap.
You should watch the Guardians movies, Maxil. They were fun, and I can't say I'm a fan of the MCU.
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 5, 2024 7:17:47 GMT
For me, the superhero genre was more interesting when there were fewer movies. Nowadays it's kinda like Big Finish. You have to wade through a lot of unimaginative and mediocre fare to find a good one.
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 9:18:52 GMT
I've not seen Morbius, no. Not because of the negativity, just that I don't really watch superhero stuff anymore. I watch the latest Batman related things, but I'm done with all the others. I can't be bothered with Gunn's Superman and now that Joker is done there's only really the second The Batman to look forward to. Apart from all that I'm perfectly happy with the Reeve Superman flicks, the 1989-1997 Batman films, the two Joker films (on reflection I honestly didn't mind the second one all that much. I'd watch it again), the first Tobey Spider-Man and the first Robert Pattinson Batman (which even then I probably won't watch that often). I don't bother with the MCU and modern DC films. I've only ever seen the first Avengers and I wasn't particularly impressed. That's fair enough. Again that's what's hilarious about Morbius it's not even a film I'd 100 percent recommend or anything. Like I said it's an average, inoffensive vampire flick, no better, no worse than the average MCU cookie cutter film and that's it. Yet it's made out to be the Room by people like Drinker because they are sheep. Like I've said before it reminds me of that episode of South Park where there is a Canadian guy called Ugly Bob who looks identical to all the other Canadians but who they make out is absolutely hideously ugly. Morbius in a nutshell. Meanwhile the superhero genre in general I think comes in for more than it's fair share of criticism. In all honesty it's no different to the Western genre which was similarly over exposed. Sadly I think the backlash from people like Scorcese is just straight up snobbery showing the superhero genre will never escape it. My advice is always take as you find. With any popular genre you'll get overexposed lame crap like the Bridey McMahon/John Wayne westerns or the MCU films, by the numbers average films like Morbius or Captain Apache, or genuine imaginative classics like Logan or The Good, The Bad and The Ugly. |
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 9:28:58 GMT
For me, the superhero genre was more interesting when there were fewer movies. Nowadays it's kinda like Big Finish. You have to wade through a lot of unimaginative and mediocre fare to find a good one. Isn't that true of every genre though? If this were the 50s, 60s or 70s we'd be saying the exact same thing about westerns, similarly kung fu movies dominated from the 70s-90s, horror movies from the 30s-40s and the 50s-70s, fantasy flicks in the 80s, vampire movies and tv shows from the 90s-2010s etc. To me the condemnation of superhero movies destroying cinema from snobs like Martin Scorcese and even guys like Drinker and Nerdrotic, is just sadly snobbery against comic books and self loathing fanboyism from them. Not saying that's what you are like as for all I know you got tired of Kung Fu movies, vampire flicks and westerns being overexposed too LOL.Again it's just the general idea that these movies are ruining cinema from snobs and again even supposed genre fans that pisses me off. Again how is Morbius, or Shazam, or Ant Man any different to say Captain Apache, a fairly average, if still enjoyable western made in the Spagheti western craze in the 1970s? How are the MCU movies which I do generally dislike any worse than the endless bland, big budget Hollywood westerns like a lot of the John Wayne ones? For every 10 Bridey McMahon type westerns you got a classic Fistful of Dollars, and for superheroes it's the same, every 10 Morbius' you get a Logan or Burton Batman. |
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 9:59:24 GMT
I saw half an hour of Morbius on streaming. It was crap. You should watch the Guardians movies, Maxil. They were fun, and I can't say I'm a fan of the MCU. I don't get that? What was so crap about it, other than it being unoriginal. It was much better than Guardians 3. I couldn't stand that movie. Karen Gillan was dreadful surprisingly in Guardians 3. Her worst performance by far. Her idea of acting was just to SHOUT. Also I've never seen a clumsier attempt at doing a feisty babe and her meekish boyfriend than Gamora and Peter in that movie. She just came over as abusive. Also the resolution to their arc after 3 f*cking movies was bollocks, whilst the main plot with the aliens was a very stupid take on Doctor Moreau. I agree though that the first two movies are excellent, with the first being the best MCU film apart from No Way Home. My ranking of superhero movies would probably be. Best films that are genuine classics Batman 1989 Batman Returns The Dark Knight The Dark Knight Rises Joker Superman 79 Superman 2 Blade Blade 2 Guardians Guardians 2 Logan X-Men X-Men 2 Days of Future Past First Class Wonder Woman 2017 Justice League, Snyder Cut Aquaman Spider-Man 2002 Spider-Man No Way Home Venom Venom 2 Man of Steel The Amazing Spider-Man Average enjoyable films that get way more than their fair share of hatred Batman Forever Superman 3 Morbius X-Men 3 (how could you hate watching big Fam torture and kill guys? They're just scared of a real woman LOL.) X-Men Appocalypse The Wolverine Spider-Man 3 The Hulk 2003 Daredevil 2003 Avengers Age of Ultron Blade Trinity Average enjoyable films that are hyped to a ridiculous degree by fandom Spider-Man 2 Iron Man Iron Man 2 Thor Doctor Strange Winter Soldier Batman Begins The Suicide Squad All the Avengers movies apart from the second. Genuine misfires. There's some good stuff in there, but it's left down by something, bad casting, bad plot twists, bad scenes etc. The Flash (2023) X-Men Origins Wolverine Superman Returns X-Men Dark Phoenix I'm not sure whether to put Batman vs Superman here or not as I thought it was okay, but I'll concede in this case that objectively a lot of the decisions that went into it, like "WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME!" and the casting of Eisenberg as an annoying, chirpy Luthor were objectively bad decisions. Elektra Guardians 3 Bad across the board, though they might be so bad they are good. Josstice League 2017 Batman and Robin Superman 4 Wonder Woman 1984 I won't rank the Deadpool movies given my seething hatred for the guys who made them no ranking could be objective LOL, and I haven't seen either Captain Marvel movie, but I'd wager given the pathetic political shit on both sides it falls into both average movies that are overhyped and overhated. |
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 5, 2024 10:09:18 GMT
Fair points, but I didn't suggest that superhero movies are destroying cinema.
I just personally find the genre overstuffed with more average fare than real stand-out material in recent years.
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 10:14:21 GMT
Fair points, but I didn't suggest that superhero movies are destroying cinema. I just personally find the genre overstuffed with more average fare than real stand-out material in recent years. I know you weren't I was just talking about the backlash to superhero movies in general. |
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Post by Ludders II on Oct 5, 2024 11:04:01 GMT
Fair points, but I didn't suggest that superhero movies are destroying cinema. I just personally find the genre overstuffed with more average fare than real stand-out material in recent years. I know you weren't I was just talking about the backlash to superhero movies in general. I was unaware there was any backlash. I only know that there are far more 'take it or leave it' S.H movies in recent years, than ones that I've really enjoyed. Although admittedly, Marvel is a lot to do with that. Plus I personally don't enjoy the proliferation of 'light entertainment/comedy' element in many S.H movies. You couldn't pay me to watch films like GotG again. Having said that Superhero movies aren't my main thing; despite enjoying a lot of them. I guess my real passion is SF and Horror. Although Horror in particular has suffered from a LOT of average/mediocre films as well. |
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 11:18:27 GMT
I know you weren't I was just talking about the backlash to superhero movies in general. I was unaware there was any backlash. I only know that there are far more 'take it or leave it' S.H movies in recent years, than ones that I've really enjoyed. Although admittedly, Marvel is a lot to do with that. Plus I personally don't enjoy the proliferation of 'light entertainment/comedy' element in many S.H movies. You couldn't pay me to watch films like GotG again. Having said that Superhero movies aren't my main thing; despite enjoying a lot of them. I guess my real passion is SF and Horror. Although Horror in particular has suffered from a LOT of average/mediocre films as well. It comes from a lot of these elitist fanboys and such who tend to sneer at things like the MCU. It's kind of like the backlash to the Big Bang Theory in that in both cases I agree with the backlash in some ways. I dislike the way the Big Bang Theory portrays women and nerds and its jokes are often thin, and I dislike the way in which superhero movies are being overexposed, but god damn as so many of these elitist fanboys, critics and other directors like Martin Scorceses such insufferable snobs I can't help but take against them. Also typically they take the backlash WAY to far. Again going on about how TBBT is the only thing that laughs at nerd culture, as though the Simpsons, Futurama, Friends etc didn't do that for decades before hand in arguably worse ways "we call owning a comic book store the widow maker, or we would if any of them had any wives", joke from The Simpsons 10 years before the TBBT, or going on about how superheroes have killed cinema because there are too many of them like Scorcese does etc. Meanwhile I think the basic problem with the superhero genre is that in many ways it's not even really a genre. Superhero is kind of a plot device more than a genre. Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman for instance are completely different genres. One is sci fi, the other gothic, crime horror fiction and another ancient mythology. Similarly is Buffy a superhero? Is the Doctor? Why not, he is every bit as much as your average Marvel character in a way. He has super powers, regeneration, super intelligence, he has advanced gadgets like Batman, and he has a large rogues gallery and multiple archenemies too? Same applies for Hercules, Solomon Kane etc. To me it should only have ever been used as a plot device, but each story should have been written to its strengths, but sadly people thought it was a genre and it became formulaic, even more so when it hit the big time. |
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Post by iank on Oct 5, 2024 11:51:41 GMT
Morbius was just dull and boring. No, not even in the same league as Guardians 3. Or Fright Night II for that matter!
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Post by burrunjor on Oct 5, 2024 12:07:10 GMT
Morbius was just dull and boring. No, not even in the same league as Guardians 3. Or Fright Night II for that matter! Well I'll give you Regina Dandridge probably puts Fright Night 2 above Morbius and above average (also thanks for reading my long posts as you know that comparison between Morbius and Fright Night 2 LOL.) Regina is the best on screen evil female vampire I've ever seen. She could eat any man for breakfast both literally and figuratively, shows how women and feminine can be dominant in her interactions with Charlie and truly is a woman that blurs the line between pain and pleasure with the very best of them like big Fam and Claire Stansfield LOL. Charlie was a lucky man being her gimp. To bad his lame ass friend Peter had to save him from that. Morbius is definitely on the level of Twins of Evil for me though. Both fairly by the numbers, but somewhat elevated by an amazing villain in Peter Cushing's mad witchfinder, the gloriously hammy Count Karnstein and Matt Smith's equally hammy and brilliant, but tragic vampire villain. However none of those guys are on the level of Regina, who really was sensational and still is. God damn it why do horror fans sleep on her? Meanwhile I've also realised what a gigantic hypocrite I look in my superhero ranking I posted to you there as I raged at the Deadpool makers for being scum, whilst praising the X-Men movies that were directed by Bryan Singer, one of the worst creepers in Hollywood (and as you can imagine that really is against some stiff competition.) I forgot about Singer as he's less of a media presence than say Ryan Reynolds, but yeah I admit I do deserve a slagging over that. With this in mind I'd probably rank the Deadpool movies as average to tell you the truth. All seething hatred of its makers aside, they don't have anything about them that is actively terrible like WW 1984 where our sympathetic female protagonist rapes a guy. (Seriously) I personally though have never liked meta humour. Osgood aside, and even then that's the dorky, ducky charm of Ingrid Oliver. I find most meta humour tedious and Deadpool's is smug and annoying and actually undermines the serious X-Men films it is a part of. I'd say all three films fall into the average flicks that fandom overhypes category objectively. |
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