The five worst episodes of the RTD era?

[RobFilth]

1. Last of the Time Turds
2. End of Grime
3. Fartners in Crime
4. Turds & Monsters
5. Fear Her

All of them, utter shite.

[Deleted]

His scripts always feel half baked and run of steam almost immediately. The Idiot's Latern is particularly terrible. I wouldn't mind so much if the horrible dad character was redeemed at the end by helping the Doctor to defeat the Wire and rescue the Gran character, but he doesn't even do that. But we're supposed to feel sorry for him at the end and Tommy, for no reason at all, ends up helping him out. Rubbish and completely undeserved.

[RobFilth]

Jul 27, 2023 15:38:20 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

His scripts always feel half baked and run of steam almost immediately. The Idiot's Latern is particularly terrible. I wouldn't mind so much if the horrible dad character was redeemed at the end by helping the Doctor to defeat the Wire and rescue the Gran character, but he doesn't even do that. But we're supposed to feel sorry for him at the end and Tommy, for no reason at all, ends up helping him out. Rubbish and completely undeserved.

It was his "traditional ways"

[Deleted]

I rather like Last of the Time Lords. I don't remember being particularly disappointed by it at the time either. I know the Jesus Doctor bit is incredibly stupid, but the rest of the episode showcases the best of Freema as an actress.

[burrunjor]

Aug 1, 2023 20:33:29 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

I rather like Last of the Time Lords. I don't remember being particularly disappointed by it at the time either. I know the Jesus Doctor bit is incredibly stupid, but the rest of the episode showcases the best of Freema as an actress.

It's one of these stories that I can see being drawn in by the spectacle, the first time you see it. At least it's not boring and there are a lot of moments that would be thrilling for kids and casual viewers like the Doctor being tortured, but honestly when you watch it back it's just too campy and overblown. It turns self indulgence into an art form LOL. 

Honestly it's not just the Jesus Doctor, the whole thing from the scissor sisters dance, to Barrowman's gun acting, to Freema Agyeman's cheesy speech (if even I am criticising my beloved how bad can it be LOL.) And the hammy acting from Simm and the others (He never walketh upon the earth) It's a cringe fest. 

[Deleted]

Aug 1, 2023 20:48:40 GMT burrunjor said:

Aug 1, 2023 20:33:29 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

I rather like Last of the Time Lords. I don't remember being particularly disappointed by it at the time either. I know the Jesus Doctor bit is incredibly stupid, but the rest of the episode showcases the best of Freema as an actress.

It's one of these stories that I can see being drawn in by the spectacle, the first time you see it. At least it's not boring and there are a lot of moments that would be thrilling for kids and casual viewers like the Doctor being tortured, but honestly when you watch it back it's just too campy and overblown. It turns self indulgence into an art form LOL. 

Honestly it's not just the Jesus Doctor, the whole thing from the scissor sisters dance, to Barrowman's gun acting, to Freema Agyeman's cheesy speech (if even I am criticising my beloved how bad can it be LOL.) And the hammy acting from Simm and the others (He never walketh upon the earth) It's a cringe fest. 

All of those are completely vaid. However, it could be much, much worse...

[burrunjor]

Oh god those are cringe personified. Believe it or not ten years ago I used to think Journey's End was a good story. Again I was caught up in the spectacle of it, but oh dear god is it stupid in hindsight. I still that the Daleks are at least formidable in it, but overall it's utterly absurd. Handy is one of the most laughable creations in the show's history. I heard a while back that there was a first draft of it that was actually quite good. I'll see if I can find it.

[iank]

Really? I assumed that WAS the first draft!

[Deleted]

Series 4 really was bullshit. Even as a nine year old I realized it was considerably dumber than the previous year. I'd honestly take Series 2 over it now.

[rushy]

Y'all have no sense of pulp glory. Them dragging the Earth back is one of the best bits of Doctor Who madness ever shown on TV.

[iank]

Aug 1, 2023 21:30:22 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

Series 4 really was bullshit. Even as a nine year old I realized it was considerably dumber than the previous year. I'd honestly take Series 2 over it now.

I wouldn't go that far. I'd say they are both as dumb as each other. 

[Deleted]

Series 3 shits on both of them from a great height.

[burrunjor]

Aug 1, 2023 21:10:50 GMT iank said:

Really? I assumed that WAS the first draft!

From what I recall in the first draft, the Brig was in it helping Martha escape, (he would have been reintroduced in the Sontaran two parter as Martha's mentor and would have helped Donna escape back home in Turn Left along with Rose) he and Martha would have also saved Sarah Jane in Part 2 and made their way into the ship and helped Jack and Sarah threaten to destroy the Daleks, before they were captured. The Shadow Prolamation had a bigger role showing up after Donna freed everybody from Davros and the Doctor shut down the reality bomb, NO handy, Donne just got time lord powers, NO Rose with her only role being in Turn Left (that wasn't intentional, it was Billie Piper being busy at first) and NO towing the earth. The Shadow Proclamation would have saved everyone from certain death after the bomb was shut down and destroyed it, after which there would have been a full battle between the Shadow Proclamation who would have included hordes of aliens, including the Kriltraine, the Slitheen, Mondasian Cybermen with the 80s design (who would be more effective against the Daleks, with it even being pointed out) In order to stop the Daleks from slaughtering the shadow proclamation, the Doctor would have destroyed them by attacking their main frame (which he also would have used to send all the planets home) whilst the Daleks were distracted in the war, mirroring his actions in the Time War, with him finally accepting he had to do that to the Daleks and a final bit where Davros comments on how they both killed their enemies to protect their own. Also Donna would have died when they got home rather than lose her memory.. 

The final Dalek/Shadow Proclamation battle had to be cut which is why the towing the earth bit had to be added for another spectacle, and the defeat of the Daleks was rushed, and Nick Courtney was junked in favour of Rose when Billie became available. (though some say he was ill?)  I also imagine Donna's death was edited for being too miserable? Meanwhile with Rose being added, my pal Jackie LOL and Noel Clarke were added, so Martha ended up being sent on a pointless quest, with no Brig. She really got the short end of the stick. 

I'm not sure how true this is. It may have just been something someone made up, but I recall it floating around the net for a while and everybody's reaction being "god damn why didn't they do that?" 

[Deleted]

Aug 1, 2023 21:43:19 GMT iank said:

Aug 1, 2023 21:30:22 GMT @kengrubshaw said:

Series 4 really was bullshit. Even as a nine year old I realized it was considerably dumber than the previous year. I'd honestly take Series 2 over it now.

I wouldn't go that far. I'd say they are both as dumb as each other. 

What I will say though is that I do enjoy that Sontaran two parter quite a lot. It's probably the best of that year for me. I don't think Helen Raynor was that bad of a writer to be honest.

[Deleted]

Jul 22, 2023 6:21:32 GMT Monster X said:

1) Fear Her
2) The Next Doctor
3) Voyage Of the Damned
4) The End Of The World
5) Rose

I do enjoy The Next Doctor, but it should have been a classic. As you said, Cybermen in Victorian London (and at Christmas!) sounds amazing, but it only ends up being a moderately fun yarn. I agree with everything else in your list, though.