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Post by burrunjor on Feb 18, 2023 12:28:50 GMT
Just wanted to address a few points made yesterday. Personally I don't think there was anything sexual given that he never did it to guys. It was only towards women and he is obviously gay. I think that he did it precisely because he felt that as he was gay, then the women wouldn't see it as predatory or sexual, and just find it funny. Meanwhile I don't doubt that there are examples of other people lower down who get annoyed with actors doing stupid things and want to speak out, but can't. It's terrible and why we should re-evaluate the industry from top to bottom, but ultimately Barrowman is far from the only example, and these women all mentioned that Barrowman never made them feel unsafe, never felt bullied by him, just that they hated his stupid humour. I absolutely agree it's systemic rather than individual, although I've not denied that. That said, it doesn't absolve Barrowman of having the urge to get his cock out incessantly in front of people who weren't consenting. A common defence is that he was "joining in the fun". This isn't a great example, given that the 'fun' wasn't mutual. This would have been evident in their body language, as it usually is when placed in sexually intimidating situations. If a woman says they feel "uncomfortable", it means that the possibility of being threatened is there. Likewise, Barrowman being gay doesn't necessarily mean that he *didn't* get a sexual kick out of it. Given, as I've cited before, his megalomaniacal nature at a convention a year ago (shouting "THEY STILL LOVE ME!"), doing so in a position of power could have also factored into it. Meanwhile I wasn't actually singling out Jackman in the wolverine story, but pointing out that the women on the set all set him up to get a good look at his dick and arse and cat called him. Again if you take that out of the context of the film and the set, then you could say Big Fam who took part in that is someone that goes around humiliating men. (though granted I wouldn't mind that from her LOL,) Also again I fail to see the difference really just because Barrowman's is to do with his knob I'm aware you weren't singling Jackman out. What I'm saying (and should have made more explicit) is that the criteria met under the Rape Crisis UK charity website says this: Flashing his knob repeatedly is noteworthy because, unlike mooning, genital exposure falls under the Sexual Offences Act. The Jackman situation doesn't suit these criteria because no one was "indecently exposed to". The sequence required that he be naked and people consented to it- it wasn't something he did purely for gratification. The same applies to those pranking him- they weren’t breaching sexual misconduct or rubbing their genitalia on him, and he consented to having the piss taken out of him. However, it absolutely applies to Barrowman in the "Monica" situation. The second point I've cited about exposure and physical contact directly relates to my post about mooning; flashing your arse doesn't entail unconsented genital contact. Exposing your penis to uncomfortable passers-by and placing it on people does, which is why people take greater exception to it at school. I haven't called him a sexual predator because no definitive evidence of that exists, but he does technically cross this specific line, and it's a line which probably explains why some posters here don't feel obliged to defend his behaviour. They pull me back in. Okay some facts about Barrowman's antics. He only did it on DW and Torchwood when he was playing a character who frequently got naked anyway, was oversexualized and where he was among friends who all encouraged him to do it and joked about it and laughed. He never did it on Desperate Housewives or Arrow or any of the films he worked on or reality shows. Yes I can believe that some of the extras didn't like it, and didn't say because he was the star, but that is not the same as him abusing them. None of them felt threatened, none of them said to him to stop, so he and everyone else thought it was just a big laugh. Like I said we should have a working environment where everyone on set feels welcome and can feel free to speak up. Meanwhile as to him getting a sexual kick out of it because he is a predator who enjoys having power over people, that is a serious allegation to throw around. You absolutely cannot base that on him being egocentric at a convention. First of all he may have been joking, and second of all, it's not a crime for him to enjoy being praised at a convention. Pretty much everyone who has worked with Barrowman has said that he is nice and down to earth, except for Eccelston, though to be fair Eccelston hated everyone on that set. There has never been any accusations of him being a diva who enjoys bullying the cast mates or extras or anything like that. James Marsters who only worked on two episodes says that there was no ill intent or anything horrible like that behind Barrowman's actions and that he was a sweetheart on set. And sorry but I can't help but feel that there is a lot of "but when I do it it's cute mentality" to justify other actors doing similar things in this thread. The Hugh Jackman incident for instance, one could argue is worse as he had no idea that was going to happen and then had every single woman on the set staring at his cock and whistling. He did NOT consent to that. He thought it was just going to be the crew filming the scene, and was then confronted with dozens of people, and he was so embarrassed when he saw them that he tried to cover his dick up with his hands and in doing so cut himself badly as he had on the wolverine claws! Imagine if that was in reverse and there was a story where say Lucy Lawless was lured down another corridor naked so every guy on set could cat call at her naked breasts without her knowing it? PS speaking of Lucy Lawless, look at this outtake where she kisses her co-star as a joke (As his character is the last one you'd expect her to end up with.) Again is that sexual assault? Again all of this is NOT to say this behaviour should be allowed on sets, but it's like I've said dozens of times. Actors who have to get comfortable with each other in ways other professions don't, like being naked in front of each other, kissing each other, hitting each other etc, often end up joking around with each other in a more intimate way than would seem normal in other environments. The downside is that some people can be forced to go along with the practical jokes or else be seen as a stick in the mud, and that when the actors are all joking around, the extras and staff can end up being made to feel uncomfortable by the actors stupid antics, but are unable to say anything. (Though as seen with Jackman, sometimes the make up people who will also get to know the actors intimately, and the extras might end up joining in the fun too, which can make it even more difficult for the very few members of staff who still might feel uncomfortable with it to speak out. To me the extras should be allowed to speak out and practical joke culture needs to stop being seen as something you have to take part in.) This is pretty much what the Barrowman situation looks like, given like I said it's not like he did it on other shows (other than one radio interview where again he was egged on to do it.) And the only people who weren't laughing along with him where a few members of staff who spoke about it over a decade later. There is no need to read into it that he is also a predator or list him in the same breath as Gary Glittler, Rolf Harris and Jimmy Savile. |
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Post by RobFilth on Feb 18, 2023 17:05:58 GMT
Shit. He almost looks like the Child Catcher from "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang". Highly disturbing viewing material. |
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Post by Bernard Marx on Feb 18, 2023 17:09:16 GMT
Shit. He almost looks like the Child Catcher from "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang". Highly disturbing viewing material. That's the exact clip I was referring to earlier. Ugh. |
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Post by RobFilth on Feb 18, 2023 17:27:41 GMT
Wasn't Chitty Chitty, Bang Bang the episode Chinballs wrote where Barrowman says, "WOAH! WOAH! Feels all kinda wrong but kinda KINKAAAAAY too!"?
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Post by UncleDeadly on Feb 18, 2023 18:33:04 GMT
Shit. He almost looks like the Child Catcher from "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang". Highly disturbing viewing material. Why doesn't he get his cock out? They all love him, right? I reckon it'd put everyone at ease... |
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Post by RobFilth on Feb 18, 2023 18:37:05 GMT
Why doesn't he get his cock out? They all love him, right? I reckon it'd put everyone at ease... "THEY STILL LOVE MEEEEEEE AND THEY LOVE MY MISTER WINKKKKEEEEE! AND YOU CAN'T STOP MEEEEE! BWAHAHAHAHAAAAAR!!!" Kind of disturbing actually considering its a room packed full of groomed kids. |
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Post by UncleDeadly on Feb 18, 2023 18:50:02 GMT
Why doesn't he get his cock out? They all love him, right? I reckon it'd put everyone at ease... "THEY STILL LOVE MEEEEEEE AND THEY LOVE MY MISTER WINKKKKEEEEE! AND YOU CAN'T STOP MEEEEE! BWAHAHAHAHAAAAAR!!!" Kind of disturbing actually considering its a room packed full of groomed kids. They ain't seen nothin' yet. If none of them walked in feeling cocky they certainly will have by the time they leave... |
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Post by RobFilth on Feb 18, 2023 19:26:10 GMT
"THEY STILL LOVE MEEEEEEE AND THEY LOVE MY MISTER WINKKKKEEEEE! AND YOU CAN'T STOP MEEEEE! BWAHAHAHAHAAAAAR!!!" Kind of disturbing actually considering its a room packed full of groomed kids. They ain't seen nothin' yet. If none of them walked in feeling cocky they certainly will have by the time they leave... I don't see what's wrong with a family day out to see John Barrowman and his Mr Winkee puppetshow myself. Kids are entertained, so where's the harm there? It's not like he's bitten Nicola Byant on the bum or anything. He's just entertained the kids with Mr Winkee and "BWAHAHAHAAAA! NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY OR WHAT YOU DO, THEY STILL LOOOOOVE MEEEE!" Perfectly acceptable behaviour. If I had kids, I'd take them myself. |
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Post by UncleDeadly on Feb 18, 2023 19:51:27 GMT
I don't see what's wrong with a family day out to see John Barrowman and his Mr Winkee puppetshow myself. Kids are entertained, so where's the harm there? Oh, i'm all for entertaining the kids. It's the one where Mr. Winkee was sick that gave me pause for thought. I couldn't help thinking of the children. The trouble is, neither could John... |
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Post by burrunjor on Feb 18, 2023 21:45:02 GMT
So now you lot are accusing him of grooming kids? Seriously you better hope he isn't reading. I'm honestly worried that kind of shit could get this forum taken down. Let's not stoop to Mr Tardis level shall we, because that is exactly what posts like "I couldn't stop thinking of the children and neither could John" are doing.
PS I find it far easier to defend Barrowman than I do Mark Hamill. FFS arsing about on set with your mates is one thing, donating millions to a Nazi government in Ukraine that tried to to start WW3, specifically to help them get drones to use in targeting civilians is so unforgivable it's practically poisoned his body of work which btw meant far more to than anything Barrowman ever did.
Also Uncle Deadly I don't know why you keep bringing up that one quote out of context when again you could do the same to a lot of your fave actors. I didn't want to mention this, but there is an outtake of Ade Edmondson where he shows off his knob to an actress in a sitcom Doctors and Nurses and when she laughs and says he showed me his knob, Ade says "tip of the iceberg baby." So you and Rob presumably must hold him in the same contempt as Barrowman and will start accusing him of being a sexual predator, a groomer of children and mention him in the same breath as Savile. You'll probably just ignore this and go back to calling Barrowman a nonce again though.
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Post by RobFilth on Feb 18, 2023 22:45:33 GMT
Burrun, you know we're just joking, right?
When you have a larger than life person like Barrowman who takes great pride in his cock being the central focus talking point to his behaviour, where it's always falling out or being exposed everywhere, then it's only going to naturally be common speculation as to where it hasn't been.
I'm pretty sure Barrowman would take great delight in us speculating about his favourite piece of his anatomy, it's why he does what he does.
and as I said in my last post, if I had kids I'd take them to a Barrowman show, I'm sure it would be hugely informative to their life learning expansion processes and they'd be highly entertained.
I'd probably warn them to keep away from the first two rows of seats however.
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Post by burrunjor on Feb 18, 2023 23:01:04 GMT
Sorry I thought it was serious as to be fair what he did DOES deserve to be criticised, scurtinized and made fun of, so it's not like you guys were being completely hyperbolic, but I just felt it was straying into uncomfortable territory, much like John's cock when it was put into a cake.
Again Barrowman was a total arse in his antics, I just don't think they were enough to finish him. I guess he falls somewhere between Gina Carano who really did nothing wrong, and Mark Hamill, who has risked poisoning his legacy with his recent actions. There are worse things to be than Barrowman evidently LOL.
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Post by mott1 on Feb 19, 2023 10:40:13 GMT
They ain't seen nothin' yet. If none of them walked in feeling cocky they certainly will have by the time they leave... I don't see what's wrong with a family day out to see John Barrowman and his Mr Winkee puppetshow myself. Kids are entertained, so where's the harm there? It's not like he's bitten Nicola Byant on the bum or anything. He's just entertained the kids with Mr Winkee and "BWAHAHAHAAAA! NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY OR WHAT YOU DO, THEY STILL LOOOOOVE MEEEE!" Perfectly acceptable behaviour. If I had kids, I'd take them myself. Speaking of Nicola, didn't Colin have his trousers undone during his regeneration scene - because they were designed for the less portly Davison? I'm surprised that, with Bryant's bosoms in close proximity, there wasn't an unfortunate accident in his very first scene as the Doctor! 🤣 |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2023 11:47:59 GMT
I don't see what's wrong with a family day out to see John Barrowman and his Mr Winkee puppetshow myself. Kids are entertained, so where's the harm there? It's not like he's bitten Nicola Byant on the bum or anything. He's just entertained the kids with Mr Winkee and "BWAHAHAHAAAA! NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY OR WHAT YOU DO, THEY STILL LOOOOOVE MEEEE!" Perfectly acceptable behaviour. If I had kids, I'd take them myself. Speaking of Nicola, didn't Colin have his trousers undone during his regeneration scene - because they were designed for the less portly Davison? I'm surprised that, with Bryant's bosoms in close proximity, there wasn't an unfortunate accident in his very first scene as the Doctor! 🤣   |
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Post by mott1 on Feb 19, 2023 19:22:39 GMT
Personally, i think it's our Mmmmmmoral Duty to gather together to form The Church of Barrowman, thus building a mighty temple to which we can flock on the sabbath in order to pay obeisance to and bask in the glory of the divine and righteous one who doth bequeath to us his "High Spirits". He was cancelled so that we may live. And at the centre, the mightiest erection of all, our sacred totem. Oh come ye, oh come ye, oh come ye....Oh, it's come....  Personally I think the Barrowman hill is an odd one to die on (and, as it's scrotum-shaped, an uncomfortable one too!) The man who was sacked from Dancing On Ice for, er, lowering the tone!? 🙄 |
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